Brehiri

Is it rape if...?

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I agree with Susan and Lighthearted Andrew.  This happened to me, 10 years ago.   

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So, this is something that happened to me. I met a guy at his home to have sex. But, once I got inside I didn't feel comfortable being there and wanted to leave. He asked me if I wanted to have sex. I said, yes, because I was scared. He gave me something to get high and asked me to take my clothes off. I only took of my skirt and underwear because I didn't want him to see my boobs. He begged me to let him have sex without a condom. I gave in even though I wanted him to use it. He bent me over his bed and pulled my hair hard and slammed himself into me. I said, Ouch really loudly. I didn't want him to continue because he was being too rough. But, I panicked and didn't say anything else. he finished up and I left immediately. .... Is this considered rape? 

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Hi Monica,

Yes this is rape. He made it so you weren't able to say no, he got you high, he intimidated you. It wasn't a freely given yes. It is a normal reaction to panic and stay silent. You did what you had to do to survive this, to keep yourself as safe as possible, and that is so courageous. I'm so sorry he hurt you in this way, you didn't deserve it and it was not your fault.

You are so not alone with this, have you thought about joining the forums?

Sending strength and care :hug:
Brehiri

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Thanks for your reply Brehiri. I've been in denial about it. I just didn't want to admit as a woman in my 30's that I would be raped. I was raped at the age of 17 too. I thought I was smarter than that. But, it does not have to do with being smart or not. Both the men that raped me should not have done what they did. i remember thinking when I went to that guys house... he said he had been called in to work at the hospital. So, when I first got to his house i was under the impression we would not be having sex and that he was only going to give me something to get high and that was it. It was all a ploy and game and to him. oh my god. He did rape me. oh my god....... I need to report him. but, how? I don't remember what month it happened. i can look up the texts he sent me on my phone. It happened this year.

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Hi Monica,

You are so brave to be sharing all this and to be considering reporting. We have a lot of info in this forum, and we also have a forum called pursuing legal action on the main board (which you'd need to sign up to) where you can share your thoughts and get support. you can also read about others' experiences as they have gone through the process.

This must all be so raw right now. Please take gentle care you you :hug: You are worthy of support and care.

Brehiri

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My 2nd ex always asked me for sexual favors after he paid for me. Guess it was rape?

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I don't feel like my sexual assault is valid because it did not involve sex but he did forcefully finger me so I guess it something but I still feel like I should not talk about it because people had it worse

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I was in a situation recently where I got too drunk and an acquaintance walked me to my car and next thing I know we're in the back seat of my car. He asks if this is okay as he is taking my pants off. I was completely out of sorts and I think I said "OK" because I wasn't aware of what was happening. Next thing I know he's on top of me having sex. I went numb and had to take my mind somewhere else. At one point I hear him saying something about not having an STD so I think he took the condom off and had sex with me without a condom. My head kept banging into the door of my car and I said "Time out my head keeps hitting the door" he doesn't stop. Eventually he stops and has this delusion that I like him, even though I'm happily in a relationship for over a year. I didn't know what to do, I didn't know if I just cheated on my boyfriend or what. The next day I felt something was wrong, I felt disgusting and dirty and I realized that what happened to me wasn't consensual. I still haven't told my boyfriend because I'm worried he is going to end things with me and blame me. Has anyone been in a similar situation? How do you explain to them what happened to you? 

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17 hours ago, Guest ANONYMOUS said:

I was in a situation recently where I got too drunk and an acquaintance walked me to my car and next thing I know we're in the back seat of my car. He asks if this is okay as he is taking my pants off. I was completely out of sorts and I think I said "OK" because I wasn't aware of what was happening. Next thing I know he's on top of me having sex. I went numb and had to take my mind somewhere else. At one point I hear him saying something about not having an STD so I think he took the condom off and had sex with me without a condom. My head kept banging into the door of my car and I said "Time out my head keeps hitting the door" he doesn't stop. Eventually he stops and has this delusion that I like him, even though I'm happily in a relationship for over a year. I didn't know what to do, I didn't know if I just cheated on my boyfriend or what. The next day I felt something was wrong, I felt disgusting and dirty and I realized that what happened to me wasn't consensual. I still haven't told my boyfriend because I'm worried he is going to end things with me and blame me. Has anyone been in a similar situation? How do you explain to them what happened to you? 

Yes, I've been there. I got to the conclusion ( recently, I was sa 4 months ago) that the body knows. You felt bad b/c your body knows it wadn't consensual. Like you, my mind went other place. That's dissociation. Like you, I was too drunk to understand what happened and -still feel - struggling with this idea of not being my fault. I should've known better, why would I call someone else such a horrible name ( a r**ist). Like you, I was in a relationship when that happened. I decided to tell, she thought it was consensual, she thought I wanted it and she has been angry about "my cheating". But she knows I didn't do it to hurt her, or "on purpose". You know, in her eyes I was exploring my sexuality. Her not understanding my pain has been devastating to me, we are still together but I wonder if we're right for each other. So I see why you wouldn't want to share this with your bf, you will take the best decision on this matter. If this still bugs you, I would really recommend to seek for help, cuz that feeling ain't going anywhere. 

I'm terrible sorry you went through that, and that you are suffering. 

Safe hugs to you. 

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so there was this situation. Happened this year. I think I just don't know how to process it. Does it count as assault if they just like touch you and you don't want them to. He said he just wanted to go for a walk. He's gonna be a sophomore and I'm about to be a senior....it's my best friends younger brother and there was odd earlier history where I feel like maybe I led him on. But he asked to go for a walk cuz his sis wasn't there to go with him and he didn't wanna go alone. So I went. And we were just talking cuz like we used to be close as friends and what not. He always kinda seemed to have that "sisters older friend" crush on me but Anyway...I suddenly noticed we were not walking where he said we were going. We ended up in the woods. Before I could ask him he kissed me. And I kind of kissed him cuz I was attracted to him but I knew it wasn't right so I pushed him off. But he kept coming on to me and trying to basically get in my pants and was being really hands all over. I kept saying no and pushing him away and I laugh when I'm nervous or in a scary situation so maybe I didn't sound serious?? He wouldn't le me to and this went on for about ten minutes although it felt like an eternity. He finally backed off and we walked in together and I acted like it didn't happen. I went on with life. But I find it replaying in my head often and idk why it won't go away. I read definitions of rape or assault and my situation doesn't match or so I feel. And I do feel like it was my fault. I was the older one and shouldn't have known better or something. Anyway what is that?? 

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Hi guest IDRK,

This is what I got from your post:

He touched you and you didn't want the touch. He took you to a secluded place in the woods. You pushed him off. You kept saying no. You kept pushing him away. He wouldn't let go. He went ahead anyway.

You didn't consent to what he did to you. You actively said no and he did it anyway, so it was assault honey. The age gap doesn't matter, he forced himself upon you after you said no verbally and showed with your body language you didn't want to. He is more than old enough to know better. None of this is your fault.

It's okay that it replays in your head and it feels like it wont go away. This is normal but you will heal from it. This website and forum has a wealth of information to show you how and to show you that you are not alone with this.

I am so sorry this happened.

Sending care and support :hug:

Brehiri

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Is it rape if your have sex with your husband and you were both drunk and high and you have to say stop 3 times before they stop?

i don't know what to do, how to feel or if I'm over dramatising this. Afterwards I ran to the toilet but then for the next couple of days or so I behaved normally and then it hit me. Is that normal? Am I normal? Don't know what to do, I feel my marriage is fractured, is it though? 

Many thanks for reading this if you did

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On 12/07/2017 at 6:42 PM, Guest Please help me said:

Is it rape if your have sex with your husband and you were both drunk and high and you have to say stop 3 times before they stop?

No means no and stop means stop. I think rape involves the willful taking of what is not being freely given, it is an act of violence that shows no concern for the other's will.

Do you feel that you were taken from in a way that obliterated your boundaries and your will?

It is normal to experience massive ups and downs in response to having been harmed. Times of realization that can be gut-wrenching and other times to feel like it's distant and somehow 'isn't real'. Can you speak to your husband about it and express how you are feeling to him?

Most importantly, your safety is number one - if you feel unsafe, for any reason, I would say seek support and help. You don't have to figure it all out on your own :metoyou:

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On 7/12/2017 at 6:42 PM, Guest Please help me said:

Is it rape if your have sex with your husband and you were both drunk and high and you have to say stop 3 times before they stop?

i don't know what to do, how to feel or if I'm over dramatising this. Afterwards I ran to the toilet but then for the next couple of days or so I behaved normally and then it hit me. Is that normal? Am I normal? Don't know what to do, I feel my marriage is fractured, is it though? 

Many thanks for reading this if you did

I would like to add to what @LionHearted already said...a marriage license is not a license to take sex by force of any kind, from your partner. 

My wife has sa me in my sleep dozens of times, no matter that I asked her and told her repeatedly to stop. It was triggering panic attacks from when I had been groomed and sa by a male predator some years before.

She has sa me by coercion, blackmail, emotional and mental abuse as well. I would say she has sa me in one way or another...over 500 times in our 18 plus years of marriage. To which, add a whole litany of dv related abuse. And I am working towards leaving her.

Your husband did this against your will, same as if it was anyone else. Except the shattered bond of trust you once had, may well be beyond repair...I know mine is.

🦁Andrew

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I was looking for advice and support. I have been in touch with my local rape crisis centre and the police although the police were good to start with but haven't been the day after...
 
Is it rape if...
 
I was out for a friend's birthday on Friday without my husband. We were drinking heavily and i can't remember what happened near the end of the night. I do remember going to get my taxi and i got speaking to this guy although i don't remember any part of the conversation.
 
Next thing i know is remembering being in the taxi rank with him vaguely and in the taxi with him. All i remember is one occassion where we were kissing. Next thing i know i remember going up the stairs in his house and then goung into his bed. I seem to think that i maybe remember removing my trousers and pants but can't be sure. I remember bits where we were having sex and he did try to give me oral sex ( i don't like oral when not waxed or washed) and when i said no he did stop but i can't remember if this attempt occurred before or after the sex. I feel guilty as this is the only thought i got in my head (waxing etc) when i asked him to stop. I also do remember slightly pushing him away but he continued and he certainly didn't ask if i was ok. I was blacking out before i even left the pub. 
 
I feel guilty as he asked if i liked it and i said yes. Guess i can't help my body's response to sex. I can't remember if it was me changing sexual positions or him. When i woke up from passing out i just grabbed my clothes and ran out his house. 
 
I went home and told my husband who said i was taken advantage of. At the time i believed i was unfaithful.  I have never cheated on my husband and have never picked a random man off the street for sex or ever went home with someone i don't know. 
 
I went to the police who were good to start with but on Monday i met them again and when we were heading up on the police car for me to show them the area where the guy stayed the main officer (who is trained for cases like this) said to me that they spoke with the taxi driver and he informed them that i was drunk but not needing carried into or out of the car and that i was able to hold a conversation. The cop also said i was seen walking straight on cctv. I informed them that i can do this in highly intoxicated states and that i was blacking out. The officer then said that being unfaithful was not a crime and that i was just drunk and not drunk AND incapable. That even if i am intoxicated i can still give consent. 
 
I spoke with the rape crisis centre who informed me that when highly intoxicated so much so that i am not remembering what i am doing is NOT consensual. Then the police tried to get me to meet with them again the next day but i declined and got the rape crisis centre to phone them to tell them to leave me alone.
 
I feel so dirty and that this was all my fault. I feel i cheated on my husband as the police seem to think so. I am getting an initial assessment appointment with the centre next week and getting sexual health checks. 
 
I have told my sister and my good friend. I have also told my best friend. I have had to tell my boss and doctor today to get signed off. My doctor was shocked of how the police have treated me and even said it is not consent. She feels i should just ignore what the police have said as it was out of order and basically a nasty thing to say. I might put in a complaint. 
 
So confused right now.

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@DonnaRose I agree with the rape crisis and your husband. It wasn't your fault, none of it was and someone took advantage of your ability to consent. I've been there, unfortunately my partner said I wanted it and that I should get over it even when she knows I'm not the type of woman who goes and have sex with strangers. Also, a T I initially went to said similar things. 

To me the bottom line and what holds me together, is knowing I don't do that, I was out of character, they don't know me better than I do. That's non-sense. 

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@Carlha Yeah my hubby said the police don't know you but i do. It is something i would never do and would never knowingly and soberly consent to. 

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drunk, left bar with man didn't know,pulled down pants, died, told him off, stopped functioning

wouldn't have done that if not drunk

since pulled down pants, not rape, right

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2 hours ago, intheprocess said:

since pulled down pants, not rape, right

Pulling down your pants is not consent. At any moment during consensual sex, consent can be taken away. No means no and being drunk also removes ability to give consent.

I would call it rape - especially since you feel off about it, you told him off and you stopped functioning. That tells me you weren't listened to and your no was ignored.

I'm sorry you are going through this - it's good that you are reaching out for support and trying to understand. You deserve healing :metoyou:

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I was actually searching for something like this to see what the answer would be. This is still very unclear to me and my emotions about it seem to be all over the place. The police were little to no help with this at all...

About a week ago, a friend and I had gone to a local club. We had drinks, but she was way drunker than I was. About 11:45pm I had gone outside and smoked a cigarette. She wanted to go back in to dance and I told her I would be in there soon. Around midnight I went back in and found that she was dancing with two guys. I didn't get a great feeling about them, but it was hard for me to be vocal about it. We started dancing and I was hoping they would lose interest and go away.

 I soon saw that the other guy was going somewhere with my friend. I tried to follow and I asked where she was going and she said the bathroom. While I was saying I'll go with you, the other guy had started pulling me away. When he asked for my number I put in an old one that was not valid. We walked out and I kept hoping people would see my face and stop us. But no one did. He asked me how long I lived here, I answered truthfully. How old I was, I answered truthfully.

 
I kept saying I need to go find her, I can't leave her. He ignored me and before I knew it we were at his car. I had gotten in and I said, I can't leave her I have to find her. He said we would be back in two hours and started driving. I pointed out the window and said shes over there, I need to find her. He pulled into a different parking spot. When we stopped, he started kissing me.
 
I was frozen, he had his hands down my shirt and before I knew it he had me leaned over. I could see him unzipping his pants. Within seconds he had my head down and kept moving my head up and down. I remember I had to re-position my lips and I feel disgusted because that probably felt good to him. I finally gagged and he let me go, I had spit on him. He asked if I was okay. I said yeah I have to go find her, and left the car and never looked back.
 
The whole time I was thinking that I should just let it happen, but why wasn't I fighting? I kept thinking my friends would think I did it to add to my list of things to be depressed about. I have other issues going on right now besides this. Eating disorder, ect. I kept hearing myself think I was letting this happen for attention. When I got out of the car I was so shocked and confused. He had cum all over my hair. I sat for an hour waiting for my other friends to get me.
 
They had called the cops when I didn't want them to. The cops asked them if it was oral, why didn't I bite? They said I was in control. I'm going to a therapist next week, but I'm worried that this is all my fault.
 
 He had also asked where I lived while we were in the car, I lied about that though. The only things I answered truthfully were my age and how long I lived where I live. I gave him the wrong number, wrong address as well. I didn't even get his name and I don't understand why the cops would insist to my friends that I might have just done it and then been embarrassed about it afterwards. 

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I'm so sorry this happened to you. It is rape. Freezing and 'allowing it to happen' is a very normal response in the moment and the cops were completely wrong in saying you were in control. That isn't true. He knew what he was doing, he knew he was on the hunt for a victim and honestly, I have also experienced being at a night club and two guys having a whole spiel on how to separate me and my friend, she was actually drugged and I had to fight the guy's friend to get back to her and drag her out of the club myself. It was awful. My point is, they know what they are doing. They plan these things and follow through on their plan.

You are not to blame whatsoever. His asking your age and how long you live there was probably him determining how much trouble he might get in - is it statutory, are you just visiting and likely to leave, etc. These are my initial thoughts, speculation. But as I said, I have experienced planned and executed decisions to try to prey on two girls/women at a club. It is not uncommon.

It is good you are going to talk to your T about it and having your emotions all over the place is also a very common response after having been raped. It should not have happened and you are not to blame for a single thing - he preyed on you. It was entirely his decision and his actions - I'm sorry you were unable to get away, he didn't listen to you and did what he had to in order to get what he wanted. He is a rapist.

I think your friends were right in calling the cops. If they got his DNA and you continue to share what happened, perhaps with the support from your T, if you both feel it is the right direction and decision, if criminal action can be taken against him and if he possibly is in the system from having done similar to someone else. I would be surprised if this was his/their first time doing this.

You deserve healing and understanding. I am happy you have come to Pandy's and I hope you are able to find the support you are looking for and deserve.

Safe :hug:, if ok.

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@LionHearted

 

Thank you for your insight. It's very much appreciated. Honestly in the town I live in (extreme tourist town, especially during the summer), things like this happen all the time. Most of the time, most children and girls aren't as lucky as I was. That's why I don't understand why the cops reacted the way they did. Especially knowing human trafficking is a huge crime around here. I tried to explain the them that I had froze, I have a history of past physical, verbal, and mental abuse and this is my reaction whenever I encounter situations like this. I'm also lucky that my two friends showed up when they did, I originally was very hard to understand on the phone and they thought I was just drunk and didn't know where I was until I made a joke about it when they pulled up. But now that I reconsider what he was asking me, it does make sense he was trying to get a feel for how much trouble he could be in. Nothing was ever asked of me, just "we'll be back in two hours" and it seems like he just settled for my insisting to find my friend. I'm just not sure if those statements were strong enough to indicate that I was saying no. Saying "I have to find her" and "I can't leave her" were the only things I was comfortable saying. I also don't understand why the police would think that because I pretty much gave him false information. Does that not alone not indicate I wasn't comfortable with him? I honestly have no idea and the way I feel about it changes from day to day. 

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He didn't give you a chance to say the word "no". You resisted each step of the way and instead of openly arguing with you or fighting - giving you space to assert yourself in a more direct way - he just stayed calm, silent and kept at his plan and kept saying that you would be back. I think it is intended to mess with your mind - even if you had said "no", he would have probably just ignored it and said something similar to what he was saying. You were up against someone who was not going to listen to you no matter what you said.

He coaxed you, lied to you - each step he took he didn't let you know what he was planning to do but kept taking you further and further from where you wanted to be - he separated you from your friend, didn't listen to you multiple times when you said you wanted to go back, relied on you being somewhat drunk or tipsy so that he could 'more easily' override your will, confuse you or convince you, which he planned to do from the outset. He forcefully moved your head, he initiated physical contact, he moved quickly towards his goal and used your presence for himself - completely ignoring your will, your wants and your safety.

The planning and thinking that these people put into it before they head out at night is incredible. They know what they are doing and how to best do it in a way that lets them not get caught, stopped or called a rapist. But he is - he is a predator. You are not to blame for anything you did or did not do - you were preyed on and some of these guys are extremely soft-spoken and they know how to get in and get out and leave the person with a reeling mind as to what just happened.

I'm so sorry this was done to you.

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@LionHearted

Thank you. Yes, I had some drinks and fireball that I had brought with me. I have developed a high tolerance for alcohol since I've been drinking pretty heavily the last few months. But around the time, 11:45-midnight, that I came back in I kind of figured my friend was way drunker than I was so I already had decided to stop drinking for the night because I figured I would have to drive her car to drive us back to my house. My friend was way drunker than I realized and it took her a while to realize what was going on. She was still with the other guy when she finally had left the club to find me. By the time she came out, my other two friends had already arrived (and they live about 45 minutes from where we were). So for about an hour I had sat by myself waiting. I don't think she had processed it, and when we tried asking the other guy what his name was, he all of a sudden couldn't speak english. My friend that had just got out of the club is half hispanic (but dosen't look like it so it seemed to throw this other guy off) so she knows spanish and attempted to ask in spanish. Nothing. It changed from, he was a friend, to someone he had just met that night. To me, the offender seemed either arabic or hispanic. 

Based on how the police handled the situation, I seriously doubt anything would come of it. I just would think they would have handled it better due to the extremely high human trafficking and kidnapping trend we have here. To them I was just a dumb girl who felt ashamed after being sexual. 

 

The first day I barley thought about it, the next few days I couldn't stop thinking about it. Now, I feel rational about it. The only thing consistent is I really don't feel anything anymore. My personality has become pretty dull. The first week  I couldn't stop washing my face, hands and mouth. Now I'm just constantly applying gloss or chap stick. Some days I don't touch my face or mouth at all. It seems the way I'm responding comes in waves...which I've seen is normal. But I feel myself handling it like I've handled past abuse in my life. I'm usually dead for a week or two and then back to normal and faking it. It usually only comes out with my excessive drinking and/ or anorexia. But hopefully the therapist would be able to help and possibly do more cognitive type questions.  

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Waves of response is completely normal and I'm sorry you have been through abuse before this. When we have been through abuse, we respond differently in threatening and abusive situations. Drinks or no drinks. It can bring up old feelings and responses and we do our best to keep ourselves safe and alive until the abuse is over. Nothing in that constitutes consent nor fault or blame. And I'm sorry that the area where you are has a lot of human trafficking and that the police seem to have no qualms over silencing and victim-blaming, which is how they treated you. It is wrong of them to do so.

I think it's very strong of you to seek out professional help from a therapist, it can be hard to overcome inner dialogue and rationalizations why what happened wasn't 'that bad' or that 'we're ok'. The thing with abuse, as you probably know, is it's insidious and it can eat away at your sense of self and you can oscillate between feeling numb and feeling overwhelmed and self-blame can keep that pattern going because if we believe we are the cause of what happened to us then we must also be the ones who can endure and fix it.

I had an ED for years and it didn't start to abate until I was able to address the core abuse I had been through and name it as such. Once my relationship with myself was strengthened and I learned more about having my own boundaries and what I can expect from people in life, my relationship with all parts of myself (including my body) improved. I learned more about self-care and self-harm and healthy and unhealthy coping mechanisms I had developed. I am still working on these myself.

What you are going through in these days is completely normal and what happened to you shouldn't have happened and it wasn't your fault. Having a therapist to help you sort through it and heal from it is a really great step to take. It takes courage and strength to seek support.

You don't have to shoulder and process what you have endured on your own :metoyou:

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